Wednesday, June 5, 2013

Whitening Bone Using Hydrogen Peroxide NOT Chlorine Bleach

BONELUST BONE PROCESSING PROGRESS: Cat Skull finished (mandible still in maceration). Note, cat only had incisor roots remaining. Front view.

I recently edited my Bad Words: BOIL & BLEACH post here adding much more extensive info about using hydrogen peroxide (H2O2). Posting it as a new blog with even more info and photos so you guys don't miss this important info.

BONELUST BONE PROCESSING PROGRESS: View Of Raccoon Skulls & Bones Recently Posted Here In Peroxide Bath. They Are Cleaning Up Nicely.
In the H2O2 bath.

ON THE DRYING RACK: Always Seem To Have Every Step Of Bone Processing Going On Here At All Times - Learn More At My Blog Bone-Lust.Blogspot.Com
Drying after the H2O2 bath.

NEVER use chlorine bleach on bones.

Chlorine based bleach permanently damages the bone itself. It will start to break down the structure of the bone and will continue to even after it is rinsed and dried. Resulting in chalky, fragile and extremely porous bone that will turn to bone meal with age. Not to mention it turns the bone yellow. Which pretty much defeats the purpose if you are trying to whiten the bone. It may appear white at first but will turn yellow. Once it yellows from bleach there is nothing you can do about it. Believe me, I've tried to salvage yellow bleached skulls before to no avail.

Bone Collectors Gold: I enjoy quickly 
changing the topic every time I buy a mass quality of Hydrogen Peroxide.
 Most people wouldn't appreciate the truth. Finding this much all at 
once isn't easy around here.

To sanitize and whiten bone use regular household hydrogen peroxide (H2O2) that you can easily and inexpensively get ahold of at the grocery store, dollar store or drugstore. Do a 50/50 bath with water just above the bones in a loose lidded plastic container to reduce evaporation. Oxygen activates the peroxide so you want to let air get to it. But it will evaporate so keep an eye on it and top it off as needed. Also, if you have a tight lid on it pressure may build up and the top literally blows off.

BONELUST - Skulls, Bones & Teeth 
in Hydrogen Peroxide Baths
Lids are loose to let oxygen in and pressure out.

How long? Just keep the bones in this bath until they are the color you want them. This is a personal preference. Note that the bone will dry lighter than it looks wet. This process can take days or weeks. Although if you leave it too long it will eventually make the bone brittle. But this usually would take months for medium sized bones like say of a raccoon. This is a very safe process for most bones if you properly follow my steps. When done whitening, rinse the bones in water then lay out to dry in the sun on towels or dry inside with a fan on. I put towels or paper towels under the bones to help pull moisture out. Be sure the bones are dry before you put them in a sealed container for storage or they may mold.

Just my usual day. Cleaning & 
sorting bones for Bone Lust projects.
Sun drying bones.

More About Mold

These were bright white cleaned bones. I thought I had left them out to dry long enough but apparently hadn't. I bagged them up in a ziploc and put them in my supply drawer. Only to find some time later that the had become splotched with black mold through the bone core and on the outside. I soaked them for weeks in full strength hydrogen peroxide but they only got this white again. In the closeup on top you can see the actual mold inside the bone. I think the molding also had to do with the bone needing to be degreased more. The mold spread to all bones in the batch though. Those not needing degreasing as well.

Problems With Bone Processing: Molded 
Bones

These bones had been cleaned and dried but got humid and grew a green fuzzy mold on them. Luckily I just hosed them off and gave them a H2O2 bath and they cleaned up beautifully. So this is a reminder to store bones in a dry place.

The Hazards Of Bone Processing In The Humid South: Moldy Bones - These Deer & Wild Boar Bones Were Already Cleaned & Stored On My Porch - All The Rain Lately Made Them Mold

Important factors: If your H2O2 bath gets really cloudy you likely need to dump it out and start a new bath. Otherwise it will start to macerate instead. Do not use a metal container with H2O2. Use plastic or glass. Store in a cool dark place. Direct sunlight will eventually deactivate H2O2 that's why it comes in dark containers. Do not do this step outside with no lid. You will just end up with deactivated H2O2, algae and insect larvae all over you bones and you'll have to start over... or the bones may be ruined.

Nearly Done: Peroxide Bathing Deer Skull 
& Jaws
Bubbles is a good sign your H2O2 is still active.

DO NOT use hair developer type peroxide on bones, ever.

There are additional ingredients in it besides H2O2 and it is MUCH stronger than regular corner store purchased H2O2. Which I think is only 3%. I have experimented with this myself and the developer turned huge deer vertebrae to literally mush in my hands. Likewise, do not use the powdered hair bleach packets. The same results will happen. So you've been warned!

Bone Processing No-No: This Is Why You NEVER Boil Bones To Clean Them. This Normally Very Thick & Strong Boar Vertebrae Literally Turned To Mush After 2 Days In Very Low Heated Water. Imagine What Damage  A Full Boil Could Do In A Matter Of Hours. I Crush
Improperly processed vertebrae that turned to mush in my hands.

Algae & Moss Covered Nature Cleaned Bones

Note that some staining will not come out especially if bones were decaying on the forest floor for some time. Remember, you want to be sure the bones have already been degreased and cleaned of all flesh/dirt/etc before putting into the peroxide.

This Is What Happens To Bones Left Outside For Too Long: Might Leave Some Of These Wild Turkey Bones This Way For My Art

Too late to clean and whiten these bones. After bones have been left in the elements for some time they begin to break down. These bones are now "living" again covered with algae/fungi that is eating it. This is one reason I choose not to do the bury method. If you wait too long bones have already begun to decay. I like processing methods where I can see what is happening to the remains at all times.

BONELUST - Old Bone Box Growth/Rot on Misc Animal Bones (Macro)

BONE PROCESSING BLOG POST WITH TIMELINE:

BONELUST BONE PROCESSING PROGRESS: First Adult Goat Skull processing progression photos & timeline.

See the post that goes along with the above photo here -  BONELUST BONE PROCESSING PROGRESS: First Adult Goat Skull processing progression photos & timeline.

For even more extensive info about all the steps I use in processing bones check out the rest of my blog. Enjoy!

115 comments:

Miss Kitty said...

Great info! No since I dont have a studio to do this in what can I do about the smell because last time I did this my house stunk like decomposing deer for 3 month.

Jana Miller said...

Thanks! There should not be a super bad smell once you get to the H2O2 step. But if there is try to rinse the bones really well first. If the H2O2 bath gets cloudy super fast and still stinks it is already time for changing the H2O2 out. I know if I drop a whole bunch of large deer or boar bones in straight after maceration this can happen. Just rinse very well first, it helps for sure. Also, you could try letting them completely dry before the H202 bath. That also helps. If you are trying to do maceration inside it is absolutely possible to do it without a bad smell too. Just be sure to have tight lidded containers. I did it in a garage before and nobody ever even realized it! Zero smell. I get old tupperware containers off of eBay to use.

Mountain Found said...

Greetings from the mountains of Arizona. Ah, thank you for such a real and refreshing blog. I'm always looking for ways to process the bones (and such) I wild-gather while out hiking. beautiful work!

Jana Miller said...

Hello from Florida Kerry! Do I ever wish I was in Arizona. I love it over there! Every time I go out West I return with loads of beautiful nature cleaned bones. Thanks for stopping by and happy bone hunting!

Anonymous said...

What do you recommend as the best way to degrease bones before the peroxide bath? I saw something in a previous post about water and dish soap. Is this something that you just let sit in a container for a certain period of time? I've been collecting bones found on hikes and am dying to start making jewelry and other kinds of art with them. Your blog has been very helpful so far! Thank you!

Jana Miller said...

Hi Pixie, as I mentioned in my only degreasing post so far I very rarely have to degrease any bones. I'm fortunate to be in a fairly warm climate and between the natural decomposition and maceration processing I do I'm left with very little grease in my bones. So I don't honestly have much experience in degreasing because I do not often have the need. But yes, many bone collectors literally let their already macerated bones then sit in a bath of water and dish soap. It is a long process. Grease slowly rises to the surface. If the water gets too cloudy/greasy a new soapy bath it made. This can take literally months. Similarly you can make a degreasing bath with ammonia and water. But note that there is very low content of water to ammonia. Too much ammonia can harm the bone structure. Sorry, I don't know the exact ratio at this moment. I will try to experiment with this stuff and do a blog post at some point but that's the best I can do right now.

NudasVeritas said...

Do you do any kind of after treatment when you are done with the H2O2 bath? I've been mentioned varnish or some oil for the bones to stay white.
Is that necessary?

Jana Miller said...

NudasVeritas - The peroxide bath is generally my last step for my personal collection. I prefer my bones raw to better see the detail and really don't like them shiny. And any kind of seal is completely unnecessary really. Also, some bones may continue to seep natural oils and you don't want that trapped under a seal. It will cause bacteria to be trapped and a bad acid reaction that can damage the bone structure. I talk about that here - http://bone-lust.blogspot.com/2013/06/bonelust-q-how-will-i-know-if-skull.html

pernillesa said...

Hi Jana! I have just found your blog, so i am sorry if this is described somewhere else, i haven't seen. But what strenght should the hydrogen peroxide be? At my local store you can get it in 3% wich you can put directly on your skin, without anything happening. And then you can get it in, i think, 18% wich says on the label, that it is for bone bleaching.
But i'm a bit afraid that the Jaw(with teeth) i want to clean would get ruined with the strong hydrogen peroxide, because it is very(propaply over a 100 years,because it was found when the road in the old part of my city was dug up) old. What do you think?
All the best, Pernille
(and sory for my horrible english!)

Jana Miller said...

Hi Pernille! Here is the US regular drugstore bought hydrogen peroxide (like pictured here) in on 3%. Then on top of that I water it down more half water, half peroxide. Honestly though for a super old bone like you describe there I would not put it in peroxide at all. Especially 18%. It won't honestly likely do anything but destroy it. It won't likely whiten it at all. Bone that old may have even begun to fossilize. I have very old bone like that myself that is brown and black. It is just going to stay like that and can not be whitened.

Unknown said...

I get great results from slow boiling the bones for 6 hrs to clean off most of the tissue and make stock for homemade stew, scrape any remaining tissue off with my pocketknife, then I bury the bones in feed salt inside a tupperware container for 3-5 days to dry, sand them lightly with fine sandpaper and make them pretty, then soak them in Hydrogen Peroxide from the grocery store to whiten. Sometimes I add some shading with a piece of coal from the campfire before a couple light coats of varnish.

Jana Miller said...

There are just so many variations of processing different types of remains and many factors come into play. Something what works really well for one person may not work for another and the same processing may not always work exactly the same for the same person on a diff specimen. There is a HUGE difference between actually boiling and simmering. A rolling boil is just not good for the structure of any kind of bone over a long period of time. While a very low heat over a shorter period of time will cause much less damage. But even that can still turn some small bones to mush. Again, so many deciding factors come into play. Like size of bones, type of bones. Large bones like deer or boar may be just fine after hours of heated flesh stripping. But smaller bones would likely begin to brittle and fall apart. More info about why not to boil here - Bad Words: BOIL & BLEACH - http://bone-lust.blogspot.com/2012/03/bad-words-boil-bleach.html

I've never heard of salt drying the bones. I have dried actual small animals, organs, limbs in similar processes though. If I want to dry bones I just set them in the sun. I prefer my bone natural and raw so I'd not likely ever sand, color/stain or seal it in any way for my actual collections. If I used them in my art projects/jewelry that's a whole other thing. That's a good example of the personal preference of the bone collector. A finished piece to one person can greatly vary from person to person.

Born in the wrong Century said...

Jana, I found your posts to be very informative and easy to read and understand. I came across a deer skeleton and kept the jaw bones. I wanted to whiten them a bit and display as a way to tell a deer age by their teeth. I am going to post about what I am doing on my blog and I was going to reference your process which will be linked back to you.
I invite you to browse my blog if you want and have time.
Thanks again for your post.
Sincerely, Rick Kratzke

whitetailwoodsblog.blogspot.com

Jana Miller said...

Great Rick, glad my blog was of help and thanks for linking to me! jana

Sblack2004 said...

Hi Jana - thanks for all this - it's hard to find good info on this subject! I have a set of of moose antlers that I am wanting to 'bleach'. Do you have any suggestions for tackling bones of such size? Obviously too large to put in a container! Any input is much appreciated :)

Sarah

Jana Miller said...

Hi Sarah, if you put any kind of antlers in a peroxide bath it will loose the natural brown/gray/golden color and turn white. If you don't care about that put them in a big strong plastic bag and pour the peroxide bath mixture in with it. Otherwise, to leave the natural coloring try cleaning only by hand with water.

Sblack2004 said...

A bag is a great idea! Yes, I want the antlers to have a 'whitewashed' appearance. Thank you!

David said...

Greetings from Argentina! I have a question that I didn't found in any of the bone collector sites that I know.
How can I sanitize things that I can't put in the peroxyde bath? I'm mostly speaking of bird beaks. I have a lot of birds macerating right now, and I don't know what to do to clean the nasty maceration water out of the bird beaks. I hope you know a method... Thank you!

Jana Miller said...

If you're concerned about whitening the colored beaks you could just soak that part is rubbing alcohol I guess. Should also sanitize it.

Debora said...

Hi Jana! I asked you a few weeks ago about my capybara skull. The maceration process went well (the mummified hide is completely gone), but now I have another question. I discovered that part of the skull, where the mummified hide used to be, is black. I'm about to start the hydrogen peroxide bath, and I'm wondering if that will be enough to get rid of the black, or if I need to do something extra (or even if there's nothing I can do at all). And if there IS something that can be done, will the colour be evened out or will that portion always be darker than the rest of the skull?

Thanks in advance!

Jana Miller said...

Hi Debora, glad it worked out! Really the only way to know if the peroxide bath will work is to give it a try. The "stain" could be any number of thing that likely can only possibly be removed by the peroxide bath. Good luck!

Unknown said...

Hello Jana - Great blog! Very informative, and I am glad to have found you. I have a question, and if it has been previously addressed, I apologise. I have a rat skeleton which was found in an old grain silo, and is thus quite clean, only requiring a bit of brushing up. He is very rigid and held together by connective tissue. As my first skeleton, and first acquisition that was not cleaned previously, I am wondering if a peroxide bath will disintegrate the connection? I have no wish to try to reassemble him. Thanks for your help.

Jana Miller said...

Hi Caren Beck!

You honestly won't know until you try. I have had some luck in the past with putting smaller remains in peroxide that were still connected that did stay together. I could even pull it out, pose it & let it dry afterwards.

good luck!

jana

Unknown said...

What if I bleached my skull? Did I seriously screw it up for ever? It wasn't in for very long but it did start to disintegrate on the weaker thinner spots. Am I screwed or can I somewhat save it? Btw I think it's a kitten skull.

Jana Miller said...

Hi Luca... That honestly depends on what strength chlorine bleach you used and for how long it soaked in it. Once it is in bone you can't really remove it anymore than minimally if your rinsed it really well with water right afterwards.

eevadesade said...

Hi from Los Angeles, amazing info i love how you didn't miss any details...i recently came across a wild boar head i think it was cleaned with insects since i found little empty insect cacoons on it. I doubt it was bleached since it still has some yellow on it. I want to bleach it but the teeth look.like they have been glued on. Will that affect the process and how long should i bleach n dry ? Also i sorry of like the natural color if i don't bleach.is that harmful to my health?

Jana Miller said...

Without actually seeing the boar skull myself I can't really tell you what the yellow is (improper previous processing or grease), how to deal with the glued in teeth, size & condition of skull, etc. If you like the way it looks as-is, then just leave it alone. Whitening is a personal preference not a requirement. I only highly suggest a peroxide bath after maceration to sanitize it.

Unknown said...

I collect bones of deer who have died on my property. Some of them have what appears to be grass stains on them. Is there a way to get rid of the grass stains?

Jana Miller said...

They are most likely algae or moss, all I can do is suggest giving them a peroxide bath if they are already defleshed. Good luck!

Unknown said...

I am trying to clean up some possum bones I found and put them in peroxide (they had been buried so there was no flesh or anything left) and some of them came out orange...any clue what would cause this?

Jana Miller said...

That's most likely soil staining from burial processing… and one of the main reasons I don't do burial processing. Many times there's nothing you can do to remove the soil staining. All I can suggest is soak it for a while in peroxide, good luck!

Jana Miller said...

Hi Christine, you'll need to macerate those skulls for that to decay and fall off of them. Then move onto a peroxide bath. Start at this blog which has links to my other related blog posts on this topic:

http://bone-lust.blogspot.com/2013/04/bonelust-bone-processing-q-what-should.html

Unknown said...

Ok, I just tired typed a message on my silly phone and something glitched, so hopefully this won't be a repeat post... anyway...
Hi Jana! Have wanted to get into this hobby for the longest time and finally pushed myself to try it this year. Couple of questions for you. I will try to make it quick:
1. For something small like a rodent skull, which has been (newly) nature-cleaned do you recommend skipping degreasing and going right to the whitening phase? (I understand you don't often do degreasing yourself)
2. I have some stubborn little bugs hiding in a couple of my skulls' crevices. I tried spraying them out with hose water, and plan on picking up some small medical forceps/tweezers to try and get the rest... but how much of a crisis is it if some get left in when you go to put them in the degreasing and/or whitening solutions? I would imagine their little bodies would eventually break down and disintegrate...
3. I have a deer skull macerating and I believe it is almost done with that stage. Some teeth have fallen out and others are still in place. From your above pictures this appears normal - that not all fall out? What do you do with loose ones during the next phases? Throw them in the solution(s) too? Or leave them out?
Thank you for your time! I've really enjoyed looking through your blog posts (I apologize if I've missed some of my inquiries answered elsewhere)

Jana Miller said...

Hi Shannon… If there is any flesh left on it at all it need to macerate otherwise go straight to the peroxide bath. Maceration normally takes care of insects as well. Although I literally carefully remove them out of the water and put them safel on dry land before sealing my maceration lid. Those insects are a very important pat of the natural deco process. If there is still some in after maceration then swish the skulls around while submerged in water and that will help remove them. Which at that point are likely molts from carrion insects mostly. They cleaned out the nasal and brain cavity for you so you didn't have to. My favorite helpers! Really not a huge issue if they are still in it all the way through the peroxide phase. I sometimes can't get some out that are lodged deep in a skull's nasal cavity. But the live ones will come out on their own when they run out of food… or with help from water submersion. As for teeth falling out, completely normal for this to happen. I usually run them through all the same steps along with the skull. And no, not all teeth of all species fall out all the time and they don't need to be removed to clean. To put them back in after all do processing just use regular white school glue. I have a post here about that as well to help put teeth in and mandibles back together. Good luck!

David said...

Any experience using Oxiclean to clean up bones?

Jana Miller said...

Hi David! I avoid using any harsh additives, cleaners, solvents in my bone processing. In my experience the more unnatural processes you put the bones through the greater than chances you are lowering the quality of them. More on that here - http://bone-lust.blogspot.com/2012/03/bad-words-boil-bleach.html

Susan said...

Hi Jana,

I'm cleaning my bear skull my maceration. I have had it in the bucket for 2 months, and dumped half of the water out after one month, and replaced it with fresh water. There is a little bit of white soft flesh on the skull still. Do I need to wait for this to come off, or can I put it in the 50/50 hydrogen peroxide solution?

Thanks,

Susan

Jana Miller said...

Hi Susan! You want to be sure everything is removed from the bone before moving onto the peroxide bath. You can't go backwards on this step. So if say you found that you couldn't get it off after the peroxide bath you'd have sanitized the bone/flesh so well that you could not easily get the maceration bacteria to grow again. Good luck! I know bear skulls can take a long time to process as they are very greasy.

Unknown said...

Jana,

Hi, I'm Tina. I need your help. My fiance' (owns a game ranch and does some skull bleaching for his customers) just walked in and handed me a hog head. My fiance' has a headache and needs my help getting this thing bright as it could possibly be. Now, you mention in your blog to NEVER use hair developing peroxide. Well, he already has used it on several bones, including this one. Fortunately, the skull is still in great condition and I think I can still manage to get it as white as he wants... with you help. What would you recommend I do at this point since he already used the hair developing peroxide? Do you have any secrets you would be willing to share with me that may help me move forward and getting this hog head a brighter white? Please and thank you in advance. Love the blog BTW!

Cristina Bencina said...

Hello!

I'm a newbie when it comes to bones. I got a four skull bundle (my first skulls ever) and I'm really excited. Three look clean and pretty white, but my coyote skull is greasy.

It's currently being degreased in warm water and dawn. I'm trying to get the general yellowish out and two noticeable brown spots. Should I degrease until the brown fades or will the peroxide handle that problem?

Secondly, unfortunately the teeth came glued. When I put the skull in water, the glue turned white. Will this affect the next step (peroxide)? Should I leave the glue as is or remove it before proceeding?

Lastly, how do you know a skull in general is sanitized? As far as I know, the seller either boiled or used bugs. Do you reccomend a peroxide bath anyway, for the other skulls at least?

Thanks for the help and tutorial, much appreciated!

Anonymous said...

Hi
How would you suggest to dump the used water/peroxide? Is it safe to put down the drain?
Thanks.

Jana Miller said...

Court Chu, it is best to dispose of the peroxide bath down the toilet or sink drink. Absolutely never pour it out outside. It will kill any living creature it touches, especially the poor worms hidden under the soil! Take care... jana

Jana Miller said...

Court Chu, it is best to dispose of the peroxide bath down the toilet or sink drink. Absolutely never pour it out outside. It will kill any living creature it touches, especially the poor worms hidden under the soil! Take care... jana

Darren said...

Dear Jana, We have deer and antler droppings that we want to whiten for home decor using the hydrogen peroxide solution. Some are intrinsically brown and others stained due to lying on the ground for a long time. In addition, they can be large (curved and up to 3' long). Any experience with antlers? Pretreatment needed at all? I may try to use a trash bag as a vessel to whiten large antlers due to volume of solution needed. Any advice or tips would be greatly appreciated! Darren

Jana Miller said...

Hey Darren, if you want to completely whiten the antler she's then hydrogen peroxide is the way to go for sure. But if you want to keep them brown or any of the patterns on them then it is the worst thing to do. No kind of pre-treatment deeded other than removing dirt. If you don't have a container large enough then you could try putting it in a really thick trash bag trying real hard not to let the antlers poke through. Or rotate the antlers in a smaller container until it looks even on all sides. Or get a cheap storage bin from a dollar store type place. Be sure to dump off the peroxide INSIDE in your bath tub or a garage sink and not outside where it will kill any creatures living in the soil. Good luck!

Jana Miller said...

Hi Cristina! I honestly could tell you if the brown will come out during degreasing or only peroxide without seeing it in person. Just see what happens. If there is actually glue in the teeth you'll want to remove the teeth (noting where they go) and scrub off the glue with a toothbrush or pull it off with your finger. Again, without knowing exactly what kind of glue was used I don't have an exact answer for you. Put the teeth back in after you're completely done with regular white school glue. No way of having any idea what processing has been doe to a skull unless you know and trust the person you got them from. If it smells it could be grease or just not sanitized yet. But hydrogen peroxide with take care of sanitary issues in your last processing step. Yes, I often do a peroxide bath is a new skull I bought smells or it a little first. Or if I have sanitary concerns. Good luck! jana

Jana Miller said...

Hi Tina… Sorry for such a long delay in my reply, I'm very busy and just now catch up on comments here. There's no reason you can't use regular 3% hydrogen peroxide after you used the hair type. It is how I whitened all of my big boar skulls. Just takes some time. Can take literally weeks of patience mostly. Good luck! jana

Unknown said...

In one of the comments you say if the maceration process smells too bad (which it always does!) then to leave in a tight lidded bucket. You do not want to do this as it will slow down the process greatly. To macerate properly you need air to be able to enter and escape, you need bacteria to be able to get in and multiply. The bacteria are what helps to eat away and degrade the flesh. Instead of taking months maceration can take as little as two weeks this way. Also their are two different ways to macerate: Cold water and warm water (needing an incubator to keep steady temps). Warm water maceration is more productive but not recommended for various animals like small rodents or if you're trying to preserve cartilage (which is possible).

Jana Miller said...

Hi Sarah, not sure where you got your info, how long you have been processing bones or what your background/education is… but you've been misinformed. I have been collecting/processing bones for 35 years now, so I'm very well aware maceration smells. It is literally putrefying of flesh. Likewise, well aware of cold and warm water maceration as I talk about both here on my blog. Also aware maceration (with a lid even) takes on average 2-3 weeks in optimal conditions. Never said it "normally" takes months, but some projects like a deer/boar spine will take at least a month. I know this from doing it countless times myself. As for the maceration bacteria, if you stick rotting flesh and bones in a bucket of water there's no need to leave a lid off. That bacteria is already on the rotting carcass. Perhaps you misunderstood some things you read here especially if you were just reading the comments. But thanks for the critique, ha.

Unknown said...

Hi Jana,and hello from England! I really hope you can help me... my husband recently fond an amazingly in-tact deer skull and antlers on a building site he was working on and the land-owner said he could keep it- it had been buried to rid it of flesh but left in the open air for a few years so had gone a bit green... we really want to do the poor deer justice by cleaning him up and displaying him but I didn't know how... until I read your blog.... so I've got him in a 50/50 3% h2o2 bath at the moment.... but the joins in his skull are seeping brown stuff... please can you help me? (I desperately hope I haven't ruined him!!!) thanks in advance, Jo in Stratford upon Avon x

dara said...

Question -- does the same method you suggest work for fish bones. I found a fish skeleton (spine intact) that I want to use in an art project. I am looking to remove the smell as well as keep them white.

Thanks,
Dara

Cari said...

I just got a old bull skull with horns. It appears to have been taken care of ok and no rotting, but has dirt and dust in some of the nooks and crannies. How do you suggest I clean and care for it? Thanks!

Jana Miller said...

Cari, theres's not really anything to do for it it sounds like other than maybe carefully hosing off the dust and cobwebs and letting it sun dry.

Jana Miller said...

Yes, Dara. Fish can clean in maceration although keeping in mind that many fish are more cartilaginous than bone. Many fish skulls for example fall apart into many smaller boney plates rather than having a solid skull like a mammal. If the finished bone looks very greasy and smells fishy when you are done you need to degrease them in 100% undiluted acetone in a glass jar. And can take months. Good luck!

Jana Miller said...

Hi Jo… I honesty highly suggest against burial processing due to bone loss, soil staining and rabid bone decay. Without seeing it I'm really not sure what the brown seeping stuff it. But my guess is that it needs degreasing. But after 2 years under ground there really should not be any grease left.

Unknown said...

Hello Jana,
I recently got a deer skull from a friend who apparently had it in her basement for some time. I went through the normal process of the peroxide bath, for I'd say about a week and a half or so. I let it dry, then began using it for an art project. I guess the glue I was using stimulated several small, white worms to begin to evacuate the skull. I sort of panicked and sprayed the entire skull down heavily with acrylic sealer, hoping that it would kill whatever else was in there and left it outside in a loosely fitted tupperware bin. The next day, I found maybe 20 more worms at the bottom of the bin, actually still alive. At this point I don't know if the skull is salvageable, I already started to decorate it and it has this sealer all over it. Any suggestions? Any ideas as to what they might be? I'm thinking the peroxide deactivated despite my keeping it in a dark place, allowing them to survive.

Jana Miller said...

Hi Kim, I've seen these bone eating "worms" myself before and I'm not sure if they are indeed a worm or if they are a type of carrion beetle larva. But I'm fairly positive they actually can live after being soaked in peroxide as I've dealt with it myself. Best thing to try to do is to freeze the skull, maybe that will work. Good luck! jana

Damien Ward said...

Hi there,
I was just wondering whether it is at all possible to whiten bones that have previously been boiled for a day or so?

As an antique restorer over the past few years i've had to boil several large antique sea turtle shells in order to remove the keratin scutes for use as furniture restoration materials but still have all of the dis articulated bones and would very much like to get them back together and looking pretty if possible.

Regards,

Damien

Jana Miller said...

Hi Damien...

There's honestly only one way to find out if it will help or not and it probably can't hurt. Granted the bone may be of less than optimal structural condition after bleaching and because of being antique.

Good luck and stay safe (as sea turtles are protected species... illegal to have for most without proper paperwork.)

jana

John said...

Hi Jana,
I can get some Giraffe shin bone that been stored in a deep freeze for a couple of months. I read that I must cook it with saltwater and then Jik & water and last with formaldehyde for some hours. Do you suggest that I use this method and at what temperature must I keep the liquid? The bone will be cut up in smaller sections.
John

Jana Miller said...

Hi John... I've never heard of any of those methods for bone processing. So I'd say, no, I do not recommend those methods. I'd suggest using maceration to remove the flesh as explained here in my blog. Then degrease if needed. Then peroxide bath. Good luck, jana

Unknown said...

Hi Jana Miller,

I have some chicken bones. I boiled them for two hours (I know, sorry, bad move) and then I removed the flesh. Afterwards, I put them in soapy water in a closed container for about an hour to degrease them. I drained the water and then let the bones dry in an open container for a few days.
Afterwards, I then put in water and Hydrogen Peroxide in a loosely lidded container. I drained and refilled the container with water and hydrogen peroxide several times.
Then I put in soapy water for maybe 1 to 3 hours and closed the container completely. I drained the water now but I noticed that a few of the bones have a purple spot and/or are tinged purple. I notice that the tinge of purple are generally where the top layer of bone may have been scratched or not there.
I'm wondering if this is an issue? Like is it mold or something? Have this ever happened to any of your bones? Should I put them in another hydrogen peroxide and water bath?
Sorry for all the questions.

Jana Miller said...

Hi Michelle...

Honestly it very likely had to do with boiling them. Sounds like trapped grease or just the bone breaking down. You may want to try to degrease for much longer. I don't think peroxide is the issue.

good luck, jana

Unknown said...

Hi Jana,

I have two parter for you!

I have come across two buffalo skulls that have some serious age to the them. Some bits of fur and skin (which was essentially mummified) was still apparent. I soaked the skin in just water and was able to peel the hide/fur back. Because they're so large (maybe about 3 ft from horn to horn) I'm not sure the best way to get them whiter. I'd like to do the peroxide soak but am not sure if it's feasible for something of that size. Any thoughts?

Also today I found a giant spine. I would say the spine is easily 3 feet long as well (maybe more! it comes past my hip). I think it may be a moose or elk. The spine is still naturally articulated and seems to have some cartilage on it as well. Any guidance to getting this baby clean?

I've been on a nationwide camping vacation and I just keep finding the greatest stuff - but these large ones are new to me.

Thanks!

Missy

Emily Bænʃi said...

Hi Jana,
I've read you blog many times before and done a lot of the same methods on here, but didn't notice the part about leaving the H2O2 bath in the sun. I did multiple cold maceration baths on small animal bones in my yard, and one bath of 50/50 water and peroxide, and ended up with weak bones hat will turn to dust with any compact. Any advice on what I can do?

LonLon said...

Hi Jana,

I have a small deer skull that has been bathing in peroxide for a couple days. I noticed that there are still some light pink stains on the skull. Is this normal or possibly ruined? I decided to take the skull out and let it dry to see if they will go away but if they don't should I give them another peroxide bath? Also while it was macerating, it was accidentally left out in the open without a lid for a bit. Some algae started to appear but I managed to hose it off. Would this have something to do with the pink stains?

Unknown said...

Hi Jana
After the degreasing step I forgot to rinse my bones with water and just put them as they were in the water/peroxide bath. Now the peroxide/water looks foamy and I wonder would it be an issue, I mean does (little) dish soap make the peroxide less effective or something?
Thanks a lot !

Unknown said...

If for any reason you don't have, or don't want to use peroxide for this, denture cleaner also works to clean the bones. The different chemicals have several cleaning effects on the bones, and doesn't compromise their structure. It's also epic for stain removing.

Unknown said...

Hi...my daughter, 14, has been bone cleaning for projects for 2 years now. Great blog!

We have a question: she found seal skulls on the beach and we soakedthem in H202 for a few weeks but the water became dark and brackish. The odor was mind blowing and larvae grew. Yuck. So we dumped it, rinsed of the bones and set out to air dry. Cleaned the container to start again. Wondering, is there an adfitive, like Oxy, we can add to avoid the bugs this time around?
Thanks for your help!

Unknown said...

Jana, hello! How nice to find your blog.
My dad told me about a fishing trip he recently went on where he saw horses living in the marsh & mentioned that they seemed to be wild. He also included that one was dying. I had to see these horses for myself so on we went to the boondocks of Louisiana in search of these beauties. Well, we found them. I study film photography & this was a dream for my eyes, mind and camera. My Dad pointed out while I was shooting that he saw the skeleton of the horse that he'd seen dying. I then made the decision to intensify my excursion. I waded from the boat to the marsh, eyes in trance on this gigantic body of bones. It was a special moment. The hide was intact & looked like it had floated up and just slightly to the side of the skeleton. I then notice the skull, which was oddly far from the rest of the remains. It was dried out and only had a small patch of hair left on the head. It smelled but not awfully. Ants & spiders claimed this pieces but I couldn't leave without it. It has since been about 2 weeks and I am about to start the process of converting this skull into an indoor marvel. I think I will try using the 50/50 (maybe even less hydrogen) for a soak. I only want to be sure I get rid of all harmful bacteria and odor. I'd like to keep this piece as much in it's originally found state as possible. Can you offer any advice on how long I should try soaking or other thoughts? Thank you for you writings, I found them to be most helpful.
Sara

Jana Miller said...

Hi Sara, sounds like a magical moment indeed! I'd highly suggest taking a look at my maceration blog posts and doing that to your horse skull before the peroxide bath otherwise it will likely not work. good luck! jana

Jana Miller said...

Hi "Unknown" with a 14-yr-old daughter and seal skulls. Sounds like you did not put a lid on your container, it needed to be degreased and/or needed to macerate before the peroxide bath. This is the last step in processing bone and it sounds like it was not ready. Also, please be aware that you could very likely be going into illegal territory depending on your location as marine mammals are protected species in many locations. Please read up on the animal parts laws in your location. Especially the Marine Mammal Protection Act (MMPA). I would also never use any additive in bone processing like Oxy. Take a look at this related blog post - http://bone-lust.blogspot.com/2012/03/bad-words-boil-bleach.html - Stay safe while collecting! jana

Jana Miller said...

Denture cleaner is a new one for me Andi, I think this calls for an experiment!

Jana Miller said...

Dorotea Giglio, I wouldn't worry about it. The peroxide just pubbles up normally so it got extra bubbly because of the soapy bones. :)

Jana Miller said...

LonLon I actually have a blog post on this topic to answer all your questions here - BONELUST Q&A: "I've been macerating bones & they are now a strange color! Are they ruined?" - http://bone-lust.blogspot.com/2015/05/bonelust-q-ive-been-macerating-bones.html

Jana Miller said...

Emily Bænʃi, In order for bone to become that brittle after peroxide... you would either have to have very small or brittle bones to begin with, have decayed/weakened bones, or have used a strong % of peroxide for that to happen. You would have to leave a medium sized animal's bone like say a fox in 3% peroxide for many many moth for them to become that brittle.

Jana Miller said...

Missy Brex, Highly sun bleached and nature cleaned bone ca be very porous and brittle and there's usually not much more you can do for it than hosing it off and/or removing dirt by hamd. And as you did, remove th mummifed skin by hand. Depending on hoe weathered the bone is maceration and even a peroxide bath could damage the bone. Perooxide also does very little for bones that are weathered grey in a poearance. There is often no grease left in the bone as well.

To clean any ribcage/spine of a medium sized/large animal just macerate it. I've found it takes me at least 4 weeks to get a deer or boar spine cleaned and apart using the maceration process.

Good luck! jana

prissypoo said...

Ok, so let me begin by thanking you for such thorough, educated info on skull cleaning. I've been a vegetarian my whole life, never eaten meat EVER. I get grossed out by everything meat-related. I know, I'm a wuss. Blame my parents!! Anyway, I was taking my dogs for a walk yesterday (I live in Tucson, AZ) in the washes, and found a javelina skull in perfect condition and what you call nature-cleaned. I put my wussiness aside and grabbed it and put it in a plastic bag and brought it home. I paint abstract art, love skulls and skins and furs (I'm half Apache indian) and grew up with that kinda stuff. Now, I will clean and whiten, then paint it something funky. There's dirt and leaves in it but other than that, it's in pristine condition. I had two guys offer to pay me for it as I walked it to my car. LOL. Again, thank you for this awesome info. You're the shit!!!

Unknown said...

How can I keep my bones white? I make necklaces out of rib bones and they are porous. They collect lint or color from whatever I wear. Eventually they become black. Some necklaces look good lime that, but some don't. How can I keep them white?

Unknown said...

Hi Jana,

Thank for the info.

I was camping on one of the remote beaches here in Oman where i came across a beautiful whale skull, unfortunately the teeth and jaw were no where to be seen but it looked wonderful nonetheless.

It was completely dry and very white. The summers reach 130 degrees Fahrenheit and it seems to be well dried out. I decided to bring it home for my two boys and they immediately loved it. When i rinsed it clean the color changed and has a lot of grey spots. (which I also think looks cool) My concern is that thats oil that i would need to remove. It has yet to dry but i put it back out into the sun. Do u recommend a Hydrogen peroxide bath? It must have been on the beach a year at least? Or will drying it be enough to mount and display it?

Thanks in advance.

Ali

The Unmaker said...

Hi Jana!
My friend and I collected some bones from a possum last night. I am just wondering if the peroxide bath would be recommended for bones of such a small size? Thank you!

Jana Miller said...

Yes, I use peroxide on opossum bones on a regular basis. I use them on much smaller bones too like squirrels and moles.

Jana Miller said...

Arsenal_Q8T Ali_Q8T - Here in the US it is illegal for me to pick up any sea mammal remains so I do not have much experience with them. And without actually seeing it it would be hard for me to say what needs to be done but whale skulls are notoriously greasy. And take a long time to degrease. But the grey bone you describe I only see in highly weathered bone which needs no degreasing and usually can not be whitened. Once highly nature cleaned there is not much we can do. But you can always try a peroxide bath.

Jana Miller said...

Gary Snyder - Our natural body oils soak into bone, unless it is sealed. I would look into polyurethane sealants.

Unknown said...

Hi, Jana,

I have several turtle shells that I want to remove the scutes from and whiten (will use your well explained advice in this post to that end). My question is what is the best way to remove the scutes?

Thanks!

=TJ

Jana Miller said...

Hi TJ, If you were to macerate the entire shell and then put it into a peroxide bath the entire shell would fall apart and the outer scutes would also pop off. If you don't want to have to completely put them back together you need to either process them completely by hand or use dermestid beetle. Good luck, I do not enjoy processing turtles myself. It is a lot of extra work.

Unknown said...

Thanks for the info, Jana. I'll let you know how it all works out. :-)

=TJ

Unknown said...

hi jana! I just finished a quick 1.5week peroxide bath for some random medium sized bones. they're at the desired whiteness but the ends of the femur and bodies of the vertebrae look really dark on the inside. I'm hoping it's just because they've been soaking and are wet but have you ever had this issue where the darkness doesn't go away? thank you! -s

Unknown said...

Greetings! I just started bone collecting and I am thinking about degreasing an entire cat skeleton I have that is just now starting to form moss, I only have the skull and jaws in the container with hydrogen peroxide, but my only concern is, do I have to have a lid on the container during the degreasing process? Thanks for reading and I hope for your reply soon!

Jana Miller said...

Hi VAP3RR0R! If the bones are mossy at this point it likely means that it is already highly nature cleaned. I highly doubt degreasing is needed at all. Best you can do it scrub them under water with a toothbrush. Peroxide may not even do much of anything either but I'd still do that step at lest to sanitize.

Jana Miller said...

Hey Unknown, so what do you dark bones look like now? Sounds like grease. But I have had mold grow INSIDE bones once before. It was strange. I actually show them in the above post. I believe that may have been caused by grease in the bone and not letting them fully dry before putting them in a sealed baggie.

Unknown said...

Hi! I stumbled across your post when I was researching how to repair the bone handle on our Alaskan Ulu knife. It was inadvertently left in water for a few days, and when I found it the handle had gone dark on the inside and it smelled terrible. I tried just leaving it outside for a few days to dry in the sun, and the smell is weak enough now that it doesn't permeate our kitchen. However, the inside of the handle is still dark, rather than the bleach white color it was when we got it. Do you think this method would work on the handle? I'd love to get it back to the original color, but I can't find any helpful information specific to knife care.

There's a chance the bone has been treated in some way, because the bone is almost glossy, but I'm not sure. Any advice you could offer would be so appreciated!

Unknown said...

I have had some possum bones that were macerating and now they're ready to be put in peroxide. I didn't know if I had enough and I told my dad to get more, but he ran into someone along the way that suggested Trisodium Phosphate for whitening instead. I've never even heard of it being used with bones. Do you know if it's safe? The type he bought was phosphate free, if that changes anything.

Jana Miller said...

Hi Kayla DeRamus... I would say no. I have never heard of using Trisodium phosphate to whiten bones. So that's a bad sign. Will likely destroy your bones. Keep it simple and use hydrogen peroxide.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trisodium_phosphate

Heron Brook Haven said...

Nice to come across a fellow bone lover....even better, one with the same name!!(my name is Jana too) Thanks for sharing your love of bones.I use them in many ways and have great success with peroxide, even on some older bones I wasn't sure it would work.

Unknown said...

Hi there! I found a Prong Horn sheep skull when I lived in Wyoming and it still has hair and skin still attached. My father says to tear off the dry skin and hair (or is it fur?) And then to boil it. He says boiling it won't ruin the skull and that it also makes it white. Is that true?

Jana Miller said...

A pronghorn skull is a really incredible find! It is actually not a type of sheep. The pronghorn's closest living relatives are the giraffes and okapi. And no, do not boil it. Not a hard rolling boil anyway. Also do not use chlorine bleach to whiten it. You want to use hydrogen peroxide for whitening, not bleach or boiling. I have a couple blog posts here on that topic already that will explain why not:

BONELUST Q&A: "Why is it bad to boil bones? It is the way I was taught to clean them a long time ago.”:

http://bone-lust.blogspot.com/2013/11/bonelust-q-why-is-it-bad-to-boil-bones.html

Bad Words: BOIL & BLEACH:
http://bone-lust.blogspot.com/2012/03/bad-words-boil-bleach.html
What you want to do instead of boiling is macerate, just put the whole thing with skull and fur into a bucket with water, here’s how it works:
The Mathematics Of Maceration - A HowTo Guide For The Patient 

http://bone-lust.blogspot.com/2012/05/mathematics-of-maceration-howto-guide.html

Jana Miller said...

Hi Paula Wetzel, Best best is to be sure your Ulu completely dries out in the sun. Very likely it has been sealed in some way by the maker, making it harder to dry. It was probably not meant to ever be left in water. It may need degreasing, it may need a peroxide whitening bath, it may also need to be resealed, I’m unsure. I would contact the maker of your Ulu and see what that say honestly. Sorry I’m not of more help.

pmcrig1 said...

Hey Jana, I found a dog skull in the woods recently and have been soaking it in a peroxide bath for few days now. I noticed that it has gotten much whiter but there are also a lot of pinkish areas on the skull. Is that normal or did I mess up the process in some way?

Jana Miller said...

Hey pmcrig1, You may need to degrease it. It is may go away after it dries. Or you may need to do another peroxide bath after it dries in case it is a bacteria. Good luck!

Unknown said...

Hi, so my boyfriend found a cow skull by his cottage and gave it to me. It is a few hundred years old because it used to be farm land up there. I just washed it finally with some water and a tooth brush to get remaining dirt off. Put it up to dry by our turtle tank light, I know it takes days to fully dry but it's giving off a weird smell and I don't know if it's mold. The skull is mainly dry as a bone literally, while a 1/4 of it that was stuck in the ground is smooth bone that's yellow orange ish in colour. The part That is dry seems to have grey tones but I'm curious if that's actually bits of green tjat could be mold ? I'm trying to figure this out so I can handle it as soon as possible to prevent any difficulties I can have down the road if I don't figure it out.

Jana Miller said...

Hi Maddison, If it actually is hundreds of years old it is likely more soil than bone now. Green is plant life growing into it. I imagine it is very fragile. Best thing to care for it is to never touch it, keep it indoors, dry and out of sunlight. This part of the above blog post refers to your skull:

“Too late to clean and whiten these bones. After bones have been left in the elements for some time they begin to break down. These bones are now "living" again covered with algae/fungi that is eating it.”

gybe said...

Hi, Jana! I have a 30% strength H2O2, should I mix it 1:10 then? I only do cow femur bones, these are dense and thick-walled. I just want to sanitize them because I make guitar nuts out of them which means a lot of cutting and sanding. Whiteness is not important here. I have a litre of 30% peroxide and I don't want to waste it all if not needed. I want to do it outside in an open garage, away from the sun in a bucket with a lid. Would soaking a couple of hours be enough for that? Thanks!

Jana Miller said...

Hi gybe! You want to dilute it down to 3% for your purposes. Be very aware that you do not want to touch 30% peroxide as it will burn you. Also do not let iron touch it as it will get an explosive reaction. It would also be bad for the bone at eve 100%. So figure out the math for making it 3%. Maybe these link would help:

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100415105218AAEakrP

http://www.using-hydrogen-peroxide.com/peroxide-dilution-chart.html

How long you soak is going to depend on condition of your bones to begin with, if they were degreased, and in part be personal preference.

Stay safe! jana

Unknown said...

Hi Jana,
I found a backbone and it still has all of the disks holding everything together. I'm afraid that if I get rid of the disks everything will fall apart. Is there a way to keep the backbone as is?

Jana Miller said...

Hi Christine Andrews... If you were to process bones by my methods here the spine would absolutely NOT be connected anymore. So if you want it to stay together exactly as is, do nothing. Or fully process then re-articculate after clean.

Unknown said...

I just wanted to say how great and easy your process is! Thanks so much for the information! Helped me tons and my skull looks amazing!!

Jana Miller said...

Thanks so much sarah collins! Glad my blog helped you out... jana

Unknown said...

Hello from pcb Florida! My boyfriend and his sister were out walking in the woods and stumbled across a drum fish skeleton. Since he knew I love bones he brought me the skull. I cleaned as much as I could off it, but it still somewhat has tissue on it. This is my first time trying this method on it. I normally just clean any decaying tissue off and leave my bones in the sun to whiten them. But as I've noticed, this makes them brittle and insects like to make homes and such (damaged a foal scapula trying this method and a mud dauber wasp made the foal jaw into its new nest). So I no longer want to try that. I'm not sure if I should be trying this since its fish bone? I cleaned every individual part of the skull, including the cervical vertebrae that were attached. But as I said, there is still some tissue on it. It's been in a 40/60 bath for two days. 40% of it being the 3% peroxide and the rest being water. I have it outside in an old plastic storing container with the lit just sitting on top (to let oxygen in as said in the blog) I also have it sitting under a loosely fitted, dark brown plastic bag to keep it dark. There are still bubbles and it is not cloudy. Am I doing this correctly? Any tips? (I'm only 15 by the way)

Jana Miller said...

Hi Rainbow SplashXD… I’m in Florida too, up in North part of the state. A peroxide bath is not want you should do if there is flesh. What you’re wanting to do instead is maceration. See my blog on that topic. But because you have put it in peroxide you’ve made it hard to macerate. Maceration relies on a bacteria to draw and remove the flesh for you. So you want to take the fish bone out of peroxide and let it dry out again. Hopefully all of the peroxide will evaporate and you can get it to macerate now. See this blog post for links to maceration related posts:

http://bone-lust.blogspot.com/2015/09/bonelust-blog-quick-links-answers-for.html

Unknown said...

The only part(s) that still somewhat have tissue are the vertebrae. All other parts were cleaned. Thank you for your help!

Unknown said...

Hello from Orlando! I have a large cat tooth that now has purple dye on it after I had it wrapped in a purpe dyed leather medicine pouch...didn't realize that sweat would cause the pouch to bleed. Is the H2O2 safe for it and will it help remove the stains?

Jana Miller said...

Hi Orlando! yes, as mentioned/shown in this blog peroxide is safe and what should be used to whiten teeth. I have no idea if it will work on your purple leather dye though. Only one way to find out. Good luck!

Unknown said...

Hi Jana! First off, thank you so much for your blog. It's been very helpful on several occasions and I have it bookmarked. Ok so I've cleaned quite a few different animal skulls in the past with no issue, but I've never done bones before. Or more particularly small bones before. Recently I've gotten into jewelry making and found both a full cat skeleton and an opossom skeleton and collected all the bones to use in jewelry and other projects. I'm now done with the maceration process but my worry is dumping and losing small bones/teeth/claws etc. It was suggested to me to use a screen, cheese cloth or strainer but that would also not allow the rotten flesh and grease to flow out and I'd be stuck sifting through a putrid gelatinous mush of rot and tiny bones. It would also probably cause me to, due to smell, go quickly and possibly not retrieve all the bones from the mush. Therefore basically putting me in the same predicament of losing bones. So I'd like to know what you do with your small bones? Do you have any better advice or solutions? Thanks, Kristi

Jana Miller said...

Hi Kristi… That is exactly what I have to do for the bones I process for my jewelry/art. Sometimes I sit there for an hour sorting bones out of maceration goo. Haha, just goes with the job. I use strainers btw. I suggest investing in a good respiration if smell is an issue for you. Get a 3M 60921 Organic Vapors & Particulates Respirator Cartridge.